Sukhoi Su-27 Flanker B Trumpeter Scale 1:32

[arb65912]

I have learnt something... the paint adheres much better when there is a primer underneath. Duh. Lol. Maybe that is why some people suggest using primer all the time.

[Guest]

AFAIK, primer has two main purposes, yes One is to adhere well to the unpainted material underneath, so that the next coats of paint won’t come off as easily, and the other is to tie the colours together so you don’t get them showing through the top layers of paint. That last part is only important if you have a model that is made up from notably lighter and darker parts, like if you’ve converted a model by using parts from another in a very different shade of plastic.

But whether or not paint adheres to plastic depends a lot on which brand and/or type of paint you use. I’ve found that Vallejo Model Air is best used with primer — it sometimes even beads up if you spray it on bare plastic. On the other hand, Tamiya and Mr. Hobby paints (which are alcohol-based) stick like glue even with nothing whatsoever underneath them, while Mission Models paint, after it has dried, can be removed from bare plastic with a wet (with water) paintbrush …

[arb65912]

AFAIK, primer has two main purposes, yes :smiling3: One is to adhere well to the unpainted material underneath, so that the next coats of paint won’t come off as easily, and the other is to tie the colours together so you don’t get them showing through the top layers of paint. That last part is only important if you have a model that is made up from notably lighter and darker parts, like if you’ve converted a model by using parts from another in a very different shade of plastic.

But whether or not paint adheres to plastic depends a lot on which brand and/or type of paint you use. I’ve found that Vallejo Model Air is best used with primer — it sometimes even beads up if you spray it on bare plastic. On the other hand, Tamiya and Mr. Hobby paints (which are alcohol-based) stick like glue even with nothing whatsoever underneath them, while Mission Models paint, after it has dried, can be removed from bare plastic with a wet (with water) paintbrush …

Thanks, Jakko!

As far as primer, I think another reason is to hide any fillings you made if the putty was some different color, right?

I am surprised how different these brands stick to the plain plastic.
That tells me that if I want to use Vallejo Air paints, I better prime all first. :tongue-out3:

[Guest]

It depends on which colour your plastic and filler are, I would say. I wouldn’t see the need to prime over light grey plastic with white filler, for example, but for dark green plastic with a lot of white filler, I just might

[arb65912]

The area you see circled on the attached screenshot, is painted (wrong color by the way but as I was not a member of the forums, I did not know....) with Vallejo Air and then with Vallejo Gloss (thick layer as you see)
I want to do wash using Flory's wash coming soon and I want to try Dry Brush as well.
Which one I do first?
I would say wash as I will need to remove wash so if I do dry brush first, I might remove it as well, correct?

Another question, will dry brush work using the same Vallejo paint with added 2 drops of white paint?
Will it work if there is already gloss coat?

Sorry for so many questions but it is my newbie right.

[arb65912]

I was shaking that primer, shaking and shaking some more.
These marks do not look good to me.
Something was wrong with it in the past, it is either old or, no idea....
I will not use it, afraid to mess things up.

What do you guys think? Agree that better safe than sorry?

[Tim Marlow]

Was the bottle stored on its side at some time? First set of marks look like tracks left by the internal ball bearing in a settled paint film. If you keep shaking the bottle they should eventually disappear as the pigment is stirred back into solution. In the second shot, those look like bubbles created in the paint during mixing. Try the paint on a test object first, before throwing it out.

[Guest]

I want to do wash using Flory's wash coming soon and I want to try Dry Brush as well.
Which one I do first?

It depends A dark wash will accentuate detail by adding shadows around parts, drybrushing with a lighter colour will accentuate detail by highlighting it. The normal order is to do the wash first, and after letting that dry thoroughly, to drybrush over it. If you don’t wait until it’s dry, you’ll end up smearing out some of the wash with your drybrushing, and that generally doesn’t look great

However, as wash darkens the overall appearance of the painted area, you can use that to your advantage to “soften” the appearance of drybrushing. That is to say, if you drybrush first and add the wash after, the drybrushing will become more blended in with the underlying paint. But, of course, at the same time it will become less obvious. This can be compensated by using a paler colour than normal for the drybrushing (before the wash), but once again, this is a matter of experience …

In the end, it depends on the effect you want to achieve, and of course, you can always wash and/or drybrush again to enhance the effect. With a wash it’s generally best to not make it too dark to start with — if it’s not obvious enough you can always go over it again with a darker wash, but toning down a wash that’s too dark is much harder. For drybrushing, it’s the other way around: if it’s too light, it’s hard to correct, but not light enough is easy.

[arb65912]

Was the bottle stored on its side at some time? First set of marks look like tracks left by the internal ball bearing in a settled paint film. If you keep shaking the bottle they should eventually disappear as the pigment is stirred back into solution. In the second shot, those look like bubbles created in the paint during mixing. Try the paint on a test object first, before throwing it out.

Hi Tim,
No, the bottle was straight from the wherever I bought it from.
I will test it somewhere before ditching it.

[arb65912]

It depends :smiling3: A dark wash will accentuate detail by adding shadows around parts, drybrushing with a lighter colour will accentuate detail by highlighting it. The normal order is to do the wash first, and after letting that dry thoroughly, to drybrush over it. If you don’t wait until it’s dry, you’ll end up smearing out some of the wash with your drybrushing, and that generally doesn’t look great :smiling3:

However, as wash darkens the overall appearance of the painted area, you can use that to your advantage to “soften” the appearance of drybrushing. That is to say, if you drybrush first and add the wash after, the drybrushing will become more blended in with the underlying paint. But, of course, at the same time it will become less obvious. This can be compensated by using a paler colour than normal for the drybrushing (before the wash), but once again, this is a matter of experience …

In the end, it depends on the effect you want to achieve, and of course, you can always wash and/or drybrush again to enhance the effect. With a wash it’s generally best to not make it too dark to start with — if it’s not obvious enough you can always go over it again with a darker wash, but toning down a wash that’s too dark is much harder. For drybrushing, it’s the other way around: if it’s too light, it’s hard to correct, but not light enough is easy.

Thank you, Jakko!!! :smiling:

I like the explanations and I already made a mistake before using black wash on no gloss, just painted surface, total disaster, I think I posted the description here.

I will use wash first and then try dry brush. It is all experimenting and learning and I love it! :tongue-out3:

[arb65912]

Was the bottle stored on its side at some time? First set of marks look like tracks left by the internal ball bearing in a settled paint film. If you keep shaking the bottle they should eventually disappear as the pigment is stirred back into solution. In the second shot, those look like bubbles created in the paint during mixing. Try the paint on a test object first, before throwing it out.

Tim, just to let you know, I used that funny looking Grey Stynylrez and it seems to be fine. Will try sand a bit tomorrow.

[arb65912]

Finish is great!!!! For priming I mean.

[rtfoe]

Here is my front canopy and broken back one.

Take a careful look at the pictures. I dipped the front one in the Pledge Floor Finish (after sanding with various grits and polishing with auto plastic compound.
There is shady area, and it is not on the outside or inside, I looked against light.

How did that happen? Something I did or it was there, I do not remember now.

The cracked and glued canopy will be sanded and dipped in Pledge Floor Finish, but cracks will be visible, so I am not trying to make cockpit look nice, I made mistakes and glued it together so it is very hard to do anything.

This is my learning and testing model anyway, so it is all good! :tongue-out3:

Let me know what you think about that grayish area. I am very curious how it happened.

I am guessing that a puddle of Pledge may have accumulated there. I normally wicker away as much of the Pledge liquid and place the canopy at an angle where most of the liquid can flow away leaving a thin film.

Cheers,
Richard

[arb65912]

I am guessing that a puddle of Pledge may have accumulated there. I normally wicker away as much of the Pledge liquid and place the canopy at an angle where most of the liquid can flow away leaving a thin film.

Cheers,
Richard

I was also thinking that, Richard.

But then I inspected it really carefully and it does not look like it is on the outside. Is it possible that Pledge kind of got inside? Sounds not very likely, no?

[rtfoe]

When you dip the canopy it should be the whole part inside and outside.

Cheers,
Richard