Ju-87 Winter

[Guest]

Hello I'm Bojo. this is a JU-87 that I made recently. Thought I'd share the pictures of it. Haven't put on the decals yet because this one is by revell and didn't include the swastika and only had the white crosses, which wouldn't look good on a winter scheme. I'm looking for feedback on the paint too, not srue if I like how it came out.

[Guest]

Morning Bojo.

What scale it it in?

I am also busy with a Ju87 Kannonvogel in 1/72 from academy and intend to do the winter colours to!

Check out my thread Academy JU87.

This one has no swastikas either.

Good luck with your project,looking good

Theuns

[Guest]

This one is 1/48 scale. I did see your thread on the stuka. The Pictures were very useful.

I decided to go with a winter scheme based on this http://www.jumbliesmodels.com/images/pixj06-20.jpg

but with a more weathered look.

Also since I don't have an air brush this is hand painted, I decided next time I hand paint that i'll thin the paint out a little to avoid brush stroke textures.

[Centurion3RTR]

Looking good Bojo, it must be the time of year because i've just finished one in winter camo and i'm working on a Panther thats going winter.

Keep up the great work, John

[spanner570]

Very nice Bojo, don't you just love winter cammo?

I usually build 1/35 armour and I've done a Tiger 1 tank in this theme and seeing the Stuka in white has given me the confidence to have a go at a 1/32 Stuka I have in my stash 'cos I can hide any paint short comings from my friends here......

I wouldn't worry about the brush strokes bud, as the white stuff was put on in just that way ( I think so anyway) so perhaps sprayed on would look totally out of place.

Any thoughts out there?

Enjoy your time here.

Ron

[Guest]

I'd say the camo would have been put on by brush although I've seen pictures where it was definitely applied by a spraygun. What I would suggest is perhaps a thinner coat next time & then use a cotton bud to rub it off a little-get that worn/used look? After all, friction through the air at 200+mph has gotta have an effect I think.

That said, it's a nice build of a strangely compelling aircraft. Keep up the good work Bojo!

Patrick

[yak face]

hi bojo, id say either method was probably used at one time or another,but as patrick says the effect of friction/weather would have made short work of it anyway,wearing a lot of it off, just look at some of the soviet aircraft that were whitewashed like this ,they ended up being very patchy! keep the pics coming cheers tony

[stona]

I'm with Tony, they put it on anyway they could. Your Stuka looks fine bojo. You can see how random it was from the piccies I posted for Theuns' in his Ju87 thread. Also just how quickly it weathered.

Cheers

Steve

[Guest]

I think the frontline planes in service with an operational unit would have most likely had it brush aplied as time was more important than neatness.Maybe planes that were being repared at a rear bace would have had it sprayed on.Just a guess here.

Theuns

[stona]

Right then,I've looked up some RLM directives regarding application of winter camouflage.

I hope you won't mind if this is a little bit technical (and serious)

From Luftwaffe Directive Sheet 27 (21/6/43)

"The Ikarin camouflage paint A2515.21 as used last winter for snow camouflage of aircraft should in future be indented for only under the designation Aircraft paint 7126.21".

Now we know what we are looking for.

From Luftwaffe Directive Sheet 43 (4/10/43)

"In accordance with TAGL I Q 2eNo1, serial number 437/43 the following is to be used for the winter camouflage of aircraft and aircraft equipment, provided such latter is fitted to the aircraft or protrudes from it (e.g. onboard armament)

Camouflage paint,white aircraft paint 7126.21."

This order also stipulates using this paint on everything from ground vehicles to tarpaulin covers.

Finally the book Der Flugzeugmaler (aircraft painter) for 1944 states:

"Snow camouflage is applied in the winter months only, with aviation lacquer 7126.21. Paintbrushes are best used to apply the colour"

Instructions also state that aircraft maintained or overhauled at maintenance units were to be returned to Eastern Front units with a solid white coating. I bet any money these were sprayed, whatever the book says. I've got photos of it being done.

I would add a word of caution. Contrary to the popular German stereotype, Luftwaffe units, particularly those a long way from Berlin, seem to have been very remiss at following the constant stream of orders and directives emanating from the RLM and Luftwaffe. Both organisations continually complain about units "doing there own thing".

(One inspectors report accuses groups in France of ruining their aircrafts finish by polishing them.)

That doesn't seem to have stopped them issuing reams of orders and corrections that any red tape bureaucracy would be proud of.

Serious hat off now and back to modelling!

Cheers

Steve

[Guest]

A freshly painted all wihite stuka, that will be interesting!

[Guest]

Thank you for the comments. Here's something very useful I found on another forum.

"The winter camo rested on painting irregularly the white colour RLM21 on standard RLM71/RLM70 camo pattern ( upper and side surfaces).The white paint was quite easy washable, that's way the Stukas with the camo looked like dirty and very run-down.The longer a plane was used the more of the white colour was disappearing."

I'm pretty happy with how it turned out. Can't wait to get the decals on there now.

[stona]

A freshly painted all wihite stuka, that will be interesting!

And entirely possible if returned from a maintenence unit. The orders do state:

"Only the upper side of the aircraft and the upper fuselage are camouflaged,down to the light blue paint on the underside.The wing and fuselage markings must remain visible"

Yet another order that wasn't always obeyed. They seem to have more or less obscured the fuselage Balkenkreuz whilst painting around the swastikas on the fin. I think Luftwaffe units felt the large fuselage crosses compromised camouflage. I have seen many images of aircraft,parked in the open, with a camouflage netting flung over the fuselage to obscure the crosses.

Steve

[stona]

Thank you for the comments. Here's something very useful I found on another forum. "The winter camo rested on painting irregularly the white colour RLM21 on standard RLM71/RLM70 camo pattern ( upper and side surfaces).The white paint was quite easy washable, that's way the Stukas with the camo looked like dirty and very run-down.The longer a plane was used the more of the white colour was disappearing."

I'm pretty happy with how it turned out. Can't wait to get the decals on there now.

Hi again bojo. It's only a technicality but the winter camouflage white wasn't RLM 21 which was a previously existing paint intended for tactical markings and insignia. I mistakenly referred to the winter paint as a distemper somewhere. Infact it was an aviation lacquer.

Anyway for we modellers they are both white and as you correctly say the white camouflage lacquer didn't stand up well to the hurly burly of service life.

Cheers

Steve

[Guest]

To be honest, I don't think many crews would want an 'all white' (is that Michael Barrymore around!?) aircraft coz even in the depths of a Russian winter, you'd never see just white, especially from the air. I bet they rubbed some of the whitewash off on purpose. Patrick