Red Baron Issue 60-Building the ailerons

[wonwinglo]

Issue Number 60-Starboard Aileron.

The starboard aileron uses the same parts as the port side ie they are not handed,this means that although the construction is basically the same the ends appear different as the fitting for the leading edge is reversed,this can be detected in the photographs above.

In order to make the assembly of the ailerons easier a simple jig can be made up,all this consists of is a few pins in a line and the leading edge is pushed against them,next the end ribs are added and a strip of wood holds them in place,now thread the spar through the centre of the ribs and instead of cutting off the end of the brass spar and glueing this as a seperate item,simply bend it to effect the correct angle,if you thread the ribs onto the spar in this way it will save fiddling to get everything in line and then having to thread the spar later.

Simply push all the ribs so they butt against the leading edge and lock with a strip of wood and some pins,now flood the joints with thin cyno and leave to dry overnight.

To really make sure that nothing is going to move later on I mixed up some slow drying metal filled epoxy and built a fillet around all of the joints,you can do this by leaving the structure pinned to the board and when dry turn everything over to do this on the other side.The photographs above shows the simple jig.

The instrument points to the bend in the brass rod as opposed to cutting it as described in the instructions.

[Guest]

Aileron construction

Hello Wonwing

I thought I had posted this a while ago, but then "lost" the thread.

Having found it again, I am wondering why you have chosen your particular method of construction.

The ailerons appear to be made from brass rod and/or tube.

I would have soldered this lot together rather than do the dual tasks of gluing with cyano and then using some sort of filler to make fillets/gussets.

I don't know if the model is going to be a flying model or static. Either way, to me, soldered joints would be much quicker and far stronger.

Please let us know why you chose your particular method of working.

Malcolm

[wonwinglo]

Hello WonwingI thought I had posted this a while ago, but then "lost" the thread.

Having found it again, I am wondering why you have chosen your particular method of construction.

The ailerons appear to be made from brass rod and/or tube.

I would have soldered this lot together rather than do the dual tasks of gluing with cyano and then using some sort of filler to make fillets/gussets.

I don't know if the model is going to be a flying model or static. Either way, to me, soldered joints would be much quicker and far stronger.

Please let us know why you chose your particular method of working.

Malcolm

*** Malcolm,the aileron ribs are made from Zamak L348 plus the tips as well,the leading edge is some strange unidentified metal that is very brittle,if everything had been brass then I certainly would have considered it,but due to the dis-similar metals and I dont think that solder would touch the Zamak from past experiences after trying to modify some castings,the biggest problem with this model is the lack of precision.ie nothing fits properly due to cheap expendable moulds ! the instructions use glue gun or quick set epoxy but I did not fancy either of these.

The model is a non flying super scale once produced by Hasegawa as a limited run kit to 500 models but re-engineered for part works.

My theory was the thin cyno would permeate fully into the joints with metal filled slow drying epoxy acting as fillets on the poory engineered joints,not my favourite method of construction but found to be the best under the difficult circumstances.

The ailerons and other framework will be painted matt white to represent the anti-dope finish on the original aircraft.

[Guest]

Thanks, I hadn't realised that there were metals other than brass - I only saw one post showing the aileron construction and everything looked "brassy".

I have soldered zinc based alloys, but appreciate that, although possible, it isn't easy.

Malcolm

[wonwinglo]

Thanks, I hadn't realised that there were metals other than brass - I only saw one post showing the aileron construction and everything looked "brassy". I have soldered zinc based alloys, but appreciate that, although possible, it isn't easy.

Malcolm

*** Cannot remember the name of the product but at a show once a chap was welding coke tins together with a type of flux,the weld was beautiful without any distortion,I purchased some of the material but never got around to using it,probably hidden amongst my bits and pieces,you know what modellers are like !

There is a full sized microlight now being built that actually uses epoxy resin to 'glue' together the framework,just like my small Fokker Triplane model.

Years ago the De Havilland company used a new material called Redux bonding produced by CIBA Geigy,this was used to literally glue the underbelly longerons on the Dove aircraft,this must have been a very early form of epoxy material but certainly made for pioneering the process.

[Guest]

My son put me on to your site acouple of days ago and your hints are marvelous. Have decided to start the ailerons now after putting it off for some time. Reasurring to know its not just me having problems, but must not give up. That wrong measurment on the fusalage frame was a real bummer.

[wonwinglo]

My son put me on to your site acouple of days ago and your hints are marvelous. Have decided to start the ailerons now after putting it off for some time. Reasurring to know its not just me having problems' date=' but must not give up. That wrong measurment on the fusalage frame was a real bummer.[/quote']*** Thats the spirit ! we will never give up with this model,you can get around a lot of the problems encountered,you will probably meet a few parts that are badly fitting or at the worst short on dimensions for the ailerons,with a bit of juggling you can work things out,best way is to lay down a piece of clear plastic sheet on the bench to stop everything sticking,assemble the ailerons flat by pinning down with strips of card held over the ribs,leading edge and trailing edge etc to hold them in position,work slowly a few pieces at a time,I used automobile cold weld adhesive which is metal filled but slow setting araldite is ideal,put plenty on bridging the gaps where necessary or adding a small spacer grafted in,when dry after a week or too grind off the surplus adhesive flush with a Dremel tool.When you do come to fit the ailerons cut the recesses carefully in the trailing edge,I used a small Swiss file working top and bottom evenly,place the wing vertically on the bench with books either side,dangle the aileron U-Shaped brackets carefully pushing onto the trailing edge adjusting as necessary,once happy after this dry run,remove and add epoxy onto these spots,follow through again holding the aileron vertically and once in position clamp up until dry,you may find a spacer of thin wood between the aileron and trailing edge will help you get the correct gap,the brackets are actually too short.Best of luck and please feel free to keep us posted,you will probably find some good ideas of your own that will prove useful to others here.

[Guest]

progress at last

Thanks to your tips Wonwinglow I've made the ailerons, elevators ond rudder and all went surprizingly well, they even fit !!!

You seem to be a couple of months ahead of me as I am expecting the carburetor and propellor next I think. And I've still got to correct the front of the fuselage frame ( and keep it square )

Trevor

[wonwinglo]

Trevor for the front fuselage make a simple jig,all it needs to be is a plank of timber with pieces glued or screwed perfectly upright,draw a centre line from the tail end to the front bulkhead,once you slide on two of the main frame formers you can build the jig to suit the necessary widths,even positioning them either side to keep things in line.This is the first model EVER that I know of that has been started from the tail ! it is just asking for errors to creep in that way,however Hachette in their amazing wisdom chose to do it this way,just take care and watch those dimensions,check back in our archives to see how the fuselage evolves,that way you will get a good mental picture of how it all goes together,I have also used more Araldite in this model than anything I have ever built,after all of the fiddling you dont want it springing apart after all.

[Guest]

Wonwinglow,

I'm ahead of you, I've extended the front fuselage frames to the correct length and surprize, the ends fit in the corresponding holes in the engine firewall. The elevators and tailplane went together as did the ailerons, although I did make my own hinges from brass strip. The Hatchette ones were c......

Trevor

[wonwinglo]

Yes I used brass strip as well for the rudder hinges,the ones supplied just snapped,only the two top holes on the firewall are used by the longerons,the two lower ones are occupied by the two side frames which locate the lower wings,the lower longerons butt up to the firewall,dont ask me why they did it that way ? and the instructions are un-clear.At first I made this mistake and soon realised that the two lower longerons are not splayed outwards.

I would have liked to have seen proper working hinges used as per the real aircraft.

If you have any pictures of your model they would be most welcome here Trevor.