Panzer & Stug Internal Colours?

[AlexBB]

Hi Ian M Thank you for your info but I am as mentioned above now OK for the White / Cream colour and will be using MRP-256 Clear doped linen as advised by Rene Molner.

My problems still relate to the German Grey-Green colour, if you see my post on Friday there is clear discrepancies between what certain paint manufacturers state for this colour and also the RAL 5012 German Lichblau which Lifecolor say is for the mechanical gears has thrown another colour into the mix which I have not found in any other internal colour references!!

I know very little about German armour and this is a big learning curve for me.

[Ian M]

Chances of finding a true colour photo of the inside of a German Tank (Or Allied for that matter) is = 0
Anything you find will either be from a hand coloured image or a modern restored subject.
I doubt very much that the manufacturers of paint just make it up.
RAL 7008 is Khaki RAL 7009 is green grey.
I know NOTHING about German Army colours other than what can be found and deduced.
The RAL 7000 Series are all the grey tones. There are 38 of them.
This site: https://www.paintcolourchart.com/ral...000-serie.html offers a good oversight of them. A good relative comparison but not a definitive. Unless you have a calibrated screen, which is almost impossible with a LED screen as the colour is affected by viewing angle!

So going back to the correct colour to use.
Floors. a light grey covered in oil/soot and mud.
Walls an off white covered in oil/soot/grease and the such.

[Tim Marlow]

Don’t over think this Alex. Colour matching in the 1940s was pretty much suck it and see. In 1940s Germany that would be even more true. If two batches of paint were identical that would be more by luck than judgement.

Stugman Bob’s advice is sound as well. Despite his disclaimer, he’s forgotten more about Stugs than most of us ever learn. The Stug G (that’s the kit subject i believe) came out late 1942, around the time grey green was dropped for the lower hull. I would personally go with a red oxide lower hull with grey green gearboxes etc to give a bit of visual interest, and don’t fret to much about exact colour matching. That way lies madness. .

[BattleshipBob]

Don’t over think this Alex. Colour matching in the 1940s was pretty much suck it and see. In 1940s Germany that would be even more true. If two batches of paint were identical that would be more by luck than judgement.

Stugman Bob’s advice is sound as well. Despite his disclaimer, he’s forgotten more about Stugs than most of us ever learn. The Stug G (that’s the kit subject i believe) came out late 1942, around the time grey green was dropped for the lower hull. I would personally go with a red oxide lower hull with grey green gearboxes etc to give a bit of visual interest, and don’t fret to much about exact colour matching. That way lies madness. .

To kind Tim ( do u take cash)

Sound advice from Tim. To confuse matters like all armour StuG' were often returned to Germany for repair/overhaul. During this time the latest changes etc were fitted which causes big problems with identifying vehicles. Factories tended to use new/old stock inc paint!

As Tim says the G was introduced Dec 43, the first batch were actually Ausf F modified to the G standard. The 1/16 kit is not that early.

I am not overly worried about specific colours/shades as it's minefield, I do not take part in discussions on other sites as it far too often gets nasty, childish and downright rude. Not for me. Never heard of a light blue gearbox?? As Ian says the chance of a clear colour interior photo is a big fat no, sadly. Plenty of B/W but no good for checking colours etc.

I personally would stick to oxide red.

[Guest]

This site: https://www.paintcolourchart.com/ral...000-serie.html offers a good oversight of them.

Beware, though, that wartime RAL colours may not match their current numbers, and that some RAL colours have been deleted — including several that German AFVs were painted in.

[AlexBB]

BattleshipBob & Tim Marlow Thanks guys for your input & help. I get concerned about trying to be as accurate as I can but these German colours seem to be a 'Minenfeld' !!

I have never done any German armour before, well nothing serious in recent years anyway.

I no longer post images of my work online nor take stuff to shows so in reality I could paint it pink if I wanted to but to me it is all a learning exercise and learning about what I am modelling is all part of the enjoyment for me. I have found the German colours to be a little contradictory especially in respect to the inside colours of the vehicles.

The Lifecolor set CS22 in particular has confused me as it contains the Light Blue mentioned above and states this is for 'Mechanical Gears" which has thrown me a bit of a curve ball as I have not seen that referenced anywhere else!!

[BattleshipBob]

What the hell is a floor combat camera lol! No idea about light blues gears as well.

[Guest]

Light blue is not an uncommon colour for gearboxes in general. I suspect the “floor combat camera” is a very poor automatic translation from the Spanish ITALIAN. If I had to guess, they mean fighting compartment floor — the word “camera” has the same root/origin as “chamber”,* and though I don’t know the Spanish word for “room/chamber” it could well be that there was some confusion there because the Italian word for “room” is camera as well.

Edit: Somehow it hadn’t clicked in my mind that this set is from LifeColor, which is Italian. It all makes much more sense now …

* Camera in Latin means “space inside a building”, chamber is from French chambre which derives from the Latin camera. English camera for a photographic device is straight from the Latin, by shortening camera obscura, “dark room” because the first photographic cameras were darkened rooms.

[Tim Marlow]

Light blue is not an uncommon colour for gearboxes in general. I suspect the “floor combat camera” is a very poor automatic translation from the Spanish. If I had to guess, they mean fighting compartment floor — the word “camera” has the same root/origin as “chamber”,* and though I don’t know the Spanish word for “room/chamber” it could well be that there was some confusion there.

* Camera in Latin means “space inside a building”, chamber is from French chambre which derives from the Latin camera. English camera for a photographic device is straight from the latin, by shortening camera obscura, “dark room” because the first photographic cameras were darkened rooms.

I seem to remember doing a floor in light blue on a half track build a few years ago…..trouble is, I had primed in red oxide and it came out a lovely shade of lavender……

[JR]

Meanwhile in Russia we had off white internals and 4 BO, no need for fancy shade cards .

[BattleshipBob]

Meanwhile in Russia we had off white internals and 4 BO, no need for fancy shade cards .

Typical no style

[Andy the Sheep]

Light blue is not an uncommon colour for gearboxes in general. I suspect the “floor combat camera” is a very poor automatic translation from the Spanish ITALIAN. If I had to guess, they mean fighting compartment floor — the word “camera” has the same root/origin as “chamber”,* and though I don’t know the Spanish word for “room/chamber” it could well be that there was some confusion there because the Italian word for “room” is camera as well.

Edit: Somehow it hadn’t clicked in my mind that this set is from LifeColor, which is Italian. It all makes much more sense now …

* Camera in Latin means “space inside a building”, chamber is from French chambre which derives from the Latin camera. English camera for a photographic device is straight from the Latin, by shortening camera obscura, “dark room” because the first photographic cameras were darkened rooms.

I can confirm: "camera" is the Italian word for "room" while "macchina fotografica" (a device for static pictures) or "cinepresa" (device for motion pictures) is the correct translation for "camera".
To be more detailed, in Italian that part of a tank is more frequently called "vano" and not "camera", the latter being mainly used talking about houses.

Andrea

[JR]

Typical no style

That is not nice !

[dalej2014]

Just read this thread with interest. Some observations.
1. As already stated paint batches would have varied, so no exact match is likely. Any cream, ivory or off white is close enough. You could even use some rascally Russian off white (but don't tell anyone!)
2. It's impressive both the passion for authenticity, detail and research we modellers undertake to be accurate, and the supportive and helpful collaboration on the forum here.
Bravo gentlemen.

[dalej2014]

Watching a couple of videos on this. The first is night shift who mixes a kind of pale Russian green, then over sprays with an off white, here:

This seems to be borne out by the second which is an interior Panzer IV video at the AAF tank museum. The tank is an "H" but modified from an earlier version, and the interior colour looks original. The link is here:

Hope it helps.