Panzer IV

[Robert1968]

The vision slits all had armoured glass, so I doubt any smoke would escape from them. You could do wisps of smoke from the hatches though,that would look good.
By the way, did you get that envelope I posted to you?

I received a parcel/ envelope with jerry cans and a few figs in ( I think that was from Perer ) I have no as yet received yours but I'm sure posies will deliver soon


Cheers


Robert

[takeslousyphotos]

I would have thought the colour of the rust depends more on the length of time that something has been exposed to the elements.
So if the tank was knocked-out fairly recently, there would be more orangey rust than brownish rust.


On most of the photos I've seen, recent damage is more white & light grey where the heat has bleached the steel.


A Google search on burnt-out cars gives lots of examples of this effect.

and very recent ...... The steel would blacken off some. much like a weld. Difficult to describe but visually a blue/black would be close. Very recent rust would start as very small areas ......... The best I can decribe it ........ If you took some 80 grit emery paper and fry brushed the very tops of the grit orange. That'd be how the rust looked when it started started.

[takeslousyphotos]

Go to Google and search "rust" ............ There are more photos than you can shake a stick at Robert.

[Robert1968]

Ok here's a sneak preview inside my head ( don't laugh)


The vision I had for the Panzer IV was it was in the last line of a retreat when they were hit with a salvo from a British flanking position say a salvo of 25pndr or an anti tank gun and the British have sent out a recon to see what if anything was left to salvage or the wreckage/ ( possibly 2/3 hours after initial contact. The flames would have possibly gone out and the British on recon come across the wreckage and see a few dead Germans who had succumbed to their injuries and picked up any loose weaponry or supplies they could find.


I read that in the dessert campaign this was done ( scavenging ) on both sides the axis and the allies


Robert

[takeslousyphotos]

Ok here's a sneak preview inside my head ( don't laugh)
The vision I had for the Panzer IV was it was in the last line of a retreat when they were hit with a salvo from a British flanking position say a salvo of 25pndr or an anti tank gun and the British have sent out a recon to see what if anything was left to salvage or the wreckage/ ( possibly 2/3 hours after initial contact. The flames would have possibly gone out and the British on recon come across the wreckage and see a few dead Germans who had succumbed to their injuries and picked up any loose weaponry or supplies they could find.


I read that in the dessert campaign this was done ( scavenging ) on both sides the axis and the allies


Robert

sounds like a great, realistic scenario Robert........... do it.

[Robert1968]

Got a bit done last night, the tank has had its second coat of paint which is RAl 8020 on upper surfaces and RAlL 7027 on lower hull. I stripped the exhaust of paint and given a light rub with 600 grit paper so it will take the rust effects better. Engine decking next to be done and weathered.


Still have to paint the tools/ weather and do some chipping effects to the turret and left side of the tank( damaged side.)


Once all that is done I'll start weathering and start on the pastels to emulate the burn effects ( thanks to Peter and Patrick on burning info with metal as I have quite a few ref pics ( colour of rust effects and burn effects on metal.


I have started making another German who has succumbed to his wounds I still need to do work on him The base is now dry ready for paint and weathering.lots still to do


All coming together slowly but surely

[monica]

looking good so far,do like the damage to the guard,and the figure has his work cut out,

[Robert1968]

looking good so far,do like the damage to the guard,and the figure has his work cut out,

Thanks Monica,


The tank is going to be destroyed and I still need to work on my German as he is dead and I know it sounds gruesome but I need to operate on his head and neck to droop it. He will be posed at the rear of the tank and this is how he died.

[monica]

thats the fun part will look forward to seeing how he turns out,

[Robert1968]

Hi guys I could do with some advice.


I am at the stage of washes and given the p4 decals etc and then I noticed ref pics of ash on the lower tracks of burnt out tank I'm trying to recreate. The bogies / wheels on left side ( damaged and burnt side are loose so I took them off to take off the rubber tyres ( not easy) , is there a 1/35 panzer 4 wheel set I can get that has no rubber tyres on them ( scanned internet but came up empty handed ) the only one I found was for Jagdpanzer which had steel wheels front 4 ) I studied the photos of burnt out tanks and the rubber burnt but the steel rims remain. I have spent time sanding the rubber off one wheel but is there a easier route to take?


Robert

[Guest]

I know that Mig Productions do a set Robert


https://www.scalemates.com/kits/194725-mig-productions-mp-35-128-burnt-out-panzer-iv-road-wheels


However, I searched but couldn't find anyone selling them at the moment.


Cutting rather than sanding would seem a better & quicker way to go.


Get a pair of pliers, or even better a pair of cutters & snip off sections of the tyre, going round the wheel with each snip. You'll end up with a rough-looking end result, but you can then sand down the remaining rough bits fairly easily with 120 grit wet & dry.


If you've already glued the 2 parts of each roadwheel together the job will be harder


If my explanation isn't too clear, let me know coz I've got some spare wheels that I can chop up to illustrate what I mean.


ps those steel wheels on the Jagdpanzer IV were to compensate for the weight of the L/70 barrel

[Robert1968]

I know that Mig Productions do a set Robert
https://www.scalemates.com/kits/194725-mig-productions-mp-35-128-burnt-out-panzer-iv-road-wheels


However, I searched but couldn't find anyone selling them at the moment.


Cutting rather than sanding would seem a better & quicker way to go.


Get a pair of pliers, or even better a pair of cutters & snip off sections of the tyre, going round the wheel with each snip. You'll end up with a rough-looking end result, but you can then sand down the remaining rough bits fairly easily with 120 grit wet & dry.


If you've already glued the 2 parts of each roadwheel together the job will be harder


If my explanation isn't too clear, let me know coz I've got some spare wheels that I can chop up to illustrate what I mean.


ps those steel wheels on the Jagdpanzer IV were to compensate for the weight of the L/70 barrel

Thanks Patrick


I had glued the wheels together but only with Tamiya thin ( painted etc but then noticed the ref pics


The wheels ( 5 I've taking off split with aid of a scalpel handle ( no damage. )........ Wish I'd taken the blade out first!!!!!


I had seen a set of burnt out panzer wheels on evilbay but at £11+ postage ?? Well thought for what I'm doing and most covered in l ash would not be really worth it


Going to do the clipper trick ( good idea )


( top rollers x 4 are iddy biddy so they gona be harder but I'll get there ( going to keep a watchful eye on the carpet monster if I drop them!!


Cheers


Robert

[Guest]

Yeah buying 'ready made' stuff kinda takes the fun out of it!


Personally I wouldn't bother with the return rollers coz they're so small.

[takeslousyphotos]

Hi guys I could do with some advice.
I am at the stage of washes and given the p4 decals etc and then I noticed ref pics of ash on the lower tracks of burnt out tank I'm trying to recreate. The bogies / wheels on left side ( damaged and burnt side are loose so I took them off to take off the rubber tyres ( not easy) , is there a 1/35 panzer 4 wheel set I can get that has no rubber tyres on them ( scanned internet but came up empty handed ) the only one I found was for Jagdpanzer which had steel wheels front 4 ) I studied the photos of burnt out tanks and the rubber burnt but the steel rims remain. I have spent time sanding the rubber off one wheel but is there a easier route to take?


Robert

I think if I was doing it Rob

I know that Mig Productions do a set Robert
https://www.scalemates.com/kits/194725-mig-productions-mp-35-128-burnt-out-panzer-iv-road-wheels


However, I searched but couldn't find anyone selling them at the moment.


Cutting rather than sanding would seem a better & quicker way to go.


Get a pair of pliers, or even better a pair of cutters & snip off sections of the tyre, going round the wheel with each snip. You'll end up with a rough-looking end result, but you can then sand down the remaining rough bits fairly easily with 120 grit wet & dry.


If you've already glued the 2 parts of each roadwheel together the job will be harder


If my explanation isn't too clear, let me know coz I've got some spare wheels that I can chop up to illustrate what I mean.


ps those steel wheels on the Jagdpanzer IV were to compensate for the weight of the L/70 barrel

If I can add a little to Patrick's great advice. The rubber on the road wheels probably wouldn't burn off 100%, there will be some residual rubber, albeit burnt ....... So leaving them a little uneven and rough wouldn't really go amiss, I would think.

[Robert1968]

Thanks again guys I've gone with Patrick's idea butt left them all a little uneven as the flames diner always burn at the same time. Will sand the small top rollers down best I can although in the whole if it your not going to see the full effect of them anyway. Need to do some more work on the pastels to get that bluefish steel burn right and add some whisks of white and rust to emulate the burn pattern. Will ne d to do the running bogies too and once all that's done I need to concentrate on dead Germans and try to emulate the shadows of the burns to the uniforms and get the facial features right again with shadows and less pinkness to the skin tones.


Cheers


Robert