Is PE worthwhile?

[banjer]

I am new to plastic modelling but an experienced figure modeller.

I have just bought an old Tamiya R75 motorcycle kit and while searching for it came across an Eduard PE upgrade.
Is PE worth the expense and effort for a novice? Does it make a significant difference to the end result or will it just discourage me due to difficulty involved?

Cheers
Bill

[papa 695]

As a novice I’d say no, not at the moment, get some builds under your belt first. Afterwards it’s a case of asking yourself is it worth the expense and will it enhance the kit.

[BarryW]

Welcome Bill.

Not an easy answer. I do think that some etch over eggs it a bit and you barely notice any difference.

Some though, really does improve things.

Also, I find that it can be impractical, at least for me, I don’t think any etch levers I have glued end on to a side or instrument panel has survived a build, those that did not ping off and disappear into the ether before being stuck on that is!

I build only aircraft, mostly in large 1/32 scale or some 1/48. So my experience reflects that. There is now a better detailing solution for aircraft, 3D printed so called ‘decals’, these only relate to decals by being on a paper carrier but are a much better and more practical solution than etch. I don’t know whether this technology, which is rather new in modelling, reaches motorcycles yet.

[The Smythe Meister]

..... In a word.....
.... "Depends" !!

[Tim Marlow]

Hi Bill
Here is the instruction sheet for that set….

https://www.eduard.com/out/media/35572.pdf

Eduard instructions are not the most informative, but you can always look them up on thier web site to see what you are getting into
I must admit, it’s not a set I would recommend as a starter. Quite a lot of fiddly stuff there, and the bike itself is quite small, so your inexperience may make handling a chore. In this case I would simply build the Tamiya kit out of the box and enjoy it.
When you’ve finished, compare it to that instruction set and see if you think it would have improved your build. If so, pick another subject, perhaps one with an etch set included, and build it with the etch.
Etch can add finesse to a build, but on the other hand it can really up the “fiddle factor” past the point of enjoyment. Personally I think it really scores on aircraft cockpit builds, but armour takes experience to decide if it really adds to the build or not.

[Scratchbuilder]

Hello Bill,
Welcome to the forum.
This is an old chestnut that we gat asked time and again, so you will not be the last.
To use etch or not?
As an armour modeller I use etch a lot, but I use it in a selective way, for instance if I am showing stowage bins open I will add the whole bin from etch, but if I just want to show the latches and padlocks, then that is all I will use. Now if we come to the stand off armour (Bar Armour) that is used on the Challenger, then I will replace it every time as the scale thickness used by the model producers can only be brought down to a certain tolerence for moulding - but they are getting better. So it is a case of look at what you want to replace and if it is only a few items then look at ways to thin down the plastic or even use thin aluminium sheet cut into strips for belts/straps.
Now does it make a difference - to be honest to you who has built the model and you are pleased with the outcome - yes. But to someone looking at your model, unless they are told then no!
Over the years I have gathered a paper drawer about 15mm deep and A4 dimensions of etch brass from various manufacturers and if I am looking for a 'butterfly' nut then I know I will have it there - but I will not go out and buy a whole set of etch just for that one item. For example I need two fire extinguisher brackets, thought I had some spare, but no, so I will scratch build them - cost wise to me a few hours at the bench - far better than £10+.
Hope this helps and you show us your first non figure build.
Cheers
Mike.

[Dave Ward]

Bill,
PE can give things that aren't possible in plastic ( like 1/700 railings & radar aerials ), and can enhance a model, but you always have to ask yourself does it actually add anything to a model? Just because an AM maker adds a part to an etched fret, doesn't mean it is better than the part it replaces. PE rivets are a case in point - essentially a 2D part representing a 3D feature. You really have to do your research on the contents of a PE set & weigh up whether it's money well spent.
As a further point, it takes a bit of practice to use PE & some modellers never master it...............
Dave

[banjer]

Thank you guys for the very helpful replies. I hope I haven't created an " Oh, God, not another photo etch thread".

You have confirmed what I was thinking that it is not worth the expense and effort for this model. I will spend the money saved on a set of Hornet replacement heads for the figures, unless someone knows different and these are not worthwhile!

Cheers

Bill

[Dave Ward]

Bill,
that Tamiya model is old - 1972 - see here https://www.scalemates.com/kits/tami...mw-r75--132354 this is a great site for research.
Until the beginning of the year, I would have recommended the Zvezda BMW R-12 Motorbike & sidecar, for a combo, but now Zvezda models are not on my shopping list ...............
Dave

[rtfoe]

Hi Bill, another reason for forgoing PE is depending on how much focus your kit gets in a diorama setting. If most of it is hidden by personal equipment like bedrolls and tarps or mud and dirt then a good paint job suffices. Most PE additions are missed if you've done it properly but screw up with boched paint and bad attempt at scale realism.
Master the build first and if you think you can go further then by all means.

Cheers,
Richard

[rtfoe]

Bill,
that Tamiya model is old - 1972 - see here https://www.scalemates.com/kits/tami...mw-r75--132354 this is a great site for research.
Until the beginning of the year, I would have recommended the Zvezda BMW R-12 Motorbike & sidecar, for a combo, but now Zvezda models are not on my shopping list ...............
Dave

The Italeri kit is not bad either. Has the right handle levers and more refined than the old Tamiya kit.

Cheers,
Richard

[banjer]

Bill,
that Tamiya model is old - 1972 - see here https://www.scalemates.com/kits/tami...mw-r75--132354 this is a great site for research.
Until the beginning of the year, I would have recommended the Zvezda BMW R-12 Motorbike & sidecar, for a combo, but now Zvezda models are not on my shopping list ...............
Dave

The Italeri kit is not bad either. Has the right handle levers and more refined than the old Tamiya kit.

Cheers,
Richard

Hi fella's,

I know the kit is old but I got it for a good price to practice on.
I have the Italeri one on my Christmas list and also the Zvezda but now I know this is Russian it will be removed.

Bill

[Jim R]

A few questions to ask when considering PE
Is the PE part "better" than the kit part? More to scale or improved detail.
Does the PE part add detail that the kit lacks?
Will any improvement provided by the PE be seen in the finished model?
And very importantly - Is it worth the effort and cost?

Every modeller has their own views on PE so taking onboard what has been said "It's up to you" :tongue-out3:

[Guest]

My take on this question: it depends

For starters, a lot of etched sets give you etched parts for the sake of giving you etched parts. Many are not an improvement on the kit’s plastic parts, and frequently are actually a step backwards — like providing etched headlight guards for vehicles that in the real world had them made from steel tubing. However, this is a matter of choosing the right set (that doesn’t do this too much) and only using the parts that are actually an improvement (rather than always using all of them).

However, just as important to me is: what kit are you going to use it on? In general, I would consider using etched parts on a 1970s or ’80s kit as throwing pearls before swine. The plastic parts of these kits are so far below today’s standards that adding etched bits is, really, a waste of effort, time and money. If you buy an etched set, you probably want a detailed model, and for that you would be better off buying a more modern kit of the subject that is already more detailed than a 1970s one even without adding etched parts. At that point, you can then always decide to buy an etched set to make it even more detailed, but chances are that, say, buying an AFV Club kit instead of a Tamiya kit of the same vehicle will give you all the detail you want. Especially as a modeller just starting out (And sure, many of those more modern kits are harder, or at least more fiddly, to build — but I can assure you that building an AFV Club kit will be easier than building an ancient Tamiya kit with an extensive set of etched detail parts.)

[Ian M]

I have found that the times I have bought PE sets, I only use about half of it as the improvements do not justify the effort to use.
As others have said newer kits need less of it.