heinkel 111

[saguy]

hi ... looking for detail of the following: heinkel he111 h-22 1./kg53 ..... the serial numbers on the side are GA (werksnummer 3107) .... did this aircraft exist at all and if it did does anyone have a little bit of it's history. tx a lot Lindsey

[AlanG]

In October, the squadron headquarters and! 1./KO53 under the command of Major Herbert Wittmann (Herbert Wittmann) (born 03.01.1914 in the town Dellnittse (Dollnitz). As part of "Legion" Condor "Wittmann fought in the war in Spain. 01.07. 1939 Lieutenant Wittmann was appointed commander of the squadron staff ICG 53. 26.07.1941, during his trip to Minsk He-111 «A 1 + GA» collided with He-111 "A1 + SA" Sergeant Major Hessler (Haussler) . Wittmann and his crew managed to jump by parachute, and the entire crew was killed Hessler. 14.10.1941

[stona]

Well Promodoller (Monogram) did a kit with markings for this aircraft 5K+GA. The G is in green meaning this aircraft was from Stab KG 53. It is entirely possible that the 5K (code for KG 53) was left off the fuselage late in the war. The aircraft and Staffel codes (GA) would have been carried behind the Balkenkreuz.The full codes should have remained on the underside of the wings.

Several He 111 H-21 bombers were converted on the production line to the He 111 H-22 missile carrying variant. III./KG 3 began operations with the He 111 H-22 on July 9,1944, in Operation Rumpelkammer. They launched scores of V-1 s against London, Southampton, and other cities. The aircraft,operating at low level at night,had exhaust shields fitted. Around the beginning of August III./KG 3 was redesignated I./KG 53.

I can't vouch for the W.Nr. I'll be home tomorrow and may be able to check then. It is certainly plausible.

Cheers

Steve

[AlanG]

Nineth one down is all i can find really for that werk nummer

WINGS PALETTE - Heinkel He.111 - Germany (Nazi)

[AlanG]

[stona]

Nice one Allyne! Interesting scheme. The splodges of a very dark colour behind the wing and around the letter A make me wonder whether the undersides might be black.

Do we think that the light mottle (RLM 76?) was applied over a splinter of RLM 70/71? I think it would have left the factory in a standard scheme.

Also as the GA is infront of the Balkenkreuz I reckon that the 5A would be behind it. The Russian profile (and my earlier conjecture) are incorrect.

Cheers

Steve

[AlanG]

All the info i see regarding 5K+GA are for when they were based at Gilze-Rijen in Holland

[stona]

All the info i see regarding 5K+GA are for when they were based at Gilze-Rijen in Holland

That makes logistical sense as they were launching V-1s. I'll look them up this evening.

Cheers

Steve

[saguy]

this is absolutley fantastic feedback guys .... tx very very much ... :blow:

I will look this evening to see if the codes for the undersides are there .... don't remember see'ing them but now i cannot be certain ..... out of interest the colour scheme of the second aircraft on the plans is said to have operated out of Venlo in Holland

[stona]

I will look this evening to see if the codes for the undersides are there ....

If the underside was blue (RLM65) then the codes would have been on the underside of the wings,either GA on one wing and 5K on the other,or just the aircraft letter G on both wings outboard of the balkenkreuz. If the underside was black they'd have been overpainted.

I'm not familiar with this unit so I can only quote common practice!

I've no record of I./KG53 on the Dutch airfields mentioned. They were formed on 9/9/44 at Varrelbusch. The Gruppe was divided with Staffeln at various airfields,1./KG53 at Varelbusch, 2./KG53 at Ahlhorn, 3./KG53 at Vechta.

In December 1944 they moved (retreated?) to Leck with an element (not sure what) at Husum.

II./KG53 and III./KG53 also converted to V-1 launchers operating from Reppen and then Bad Zwischenahn and Shleswig and Griefwald respectively. The re-locations to the North/East were presumably to avoid the advance of the Western allies across the low countries and into Northern Germany.

Cheers

Steve

[stona]

I also found this.

V-1 flying bombs Fi103 launched from a German HE-111 bomber aircraft, and from a German JU-188 bomber aircraft.

I have a book about air launched V-1s but I can't find it. I have either loaned it out or stuck it in my loft with the stuff I don't have room for on my shelves. If it turns up I'll see what I can find.

Cheers

Steve

[saguy]

hi there steve and Allyne.... tx for this info (the video piece is quite amazing) ... it certainly adds an extra degree of realism to my model ... i checked the decals and only the balkenkreuz appear on the undersurfaces (rlm76). My error on the Venlo aircraft .. it is 1.KG3 not 1.KG53. Can i ask what the yellow band on the fuselage means?

[stona]

1./KG3 (that's an arabic 1 for 1 Staffel) didn't fly the He111 as far as I can tell. They disbanded in July 1944 still flying the Ju88.

III./KG3 (that's a Roman numeral for the third Gruppe) were at Venlo from 28/6/44 to 9/9/44. III Gruppe comprised Stab and 7,8 and 9 KG3.

On 9/9/44 these units became re-designated as I./KG53. That is Stab III./KG3 became Stab I./KG53. 7./KG3 became 1./KG53. 8./KG3 became 2./KG53. 9./KG3 became 3./KG53.

When this sort of redesignation occurred the unit would simply be renamed all its equipment,ground support and auxiliary services would have remained in place. Effectively III./KG3 simply became I./KG53.

I hope this makes sense,I know how confusing Luftwaffe designations can be! Any questions feel free to ask,I'll do my best to clarify.

I'm not sure which yellow band you mean.

Cheers

Steve

[saguy]

hi there steve .. here is a pic of the painting schemes / decal placement ... yellow band on the fuselage and the reference to the venlo based aircraft ....i'm obviously doing the 1.kg53 version ....tx for all your insight it is fascinating ....Lindsey

[ATTACH]39031.IPB[/ATTACH]

[stona]

Not sure,the yellow fuselage band looks like an oversized Eastern Front theatre marking! They had been there earlier. The yellow rudder must be an identifier they used themselves,it's something that was common much earlier during the BoB.

I don't have much on this unit until I find or retrieve my missing book!

Cheers

Steve