To paint before or to paint after ... that is the question!

[Guest]

Today my Airfix Douglas C 47 came in the mail! (Three weeks ahead of the estimated delivery! Yay!) I am very excited to get started building, but since I am still a newbie, I wanted to ask a few paint-related questions before I get too far into it.


I have seen several different methods/orderings for painting. Some people seem to paint the model before putting it together, and others paint it after it is assembled. On all my previous kits, I painted them after assembly, but that was pretty easy since they were just open cockpit bipanes and I could pretty much add any detail in at the very end. The C 47 has a lot of interior detail, which I know I will have to paint first just because I couldn't maneuver a brush around after assembly. However, what about the exterior? Can I wait and do it after assembly? Or is it better to paint it before (would it leak onto the inside if I did it last?)?


Also, do I need to prime the interior pieces if I paint them first? I figure I should paint them before removing them from the sprue, so I'd have to spray primer on the whole lot of pieces that are on that sheet. Would having primer on the rest of the pieces affect assembly in any way? I'd probably have to scratch it off of any surfaces requiring glue, right?


Thanks for taking the time to answer my newb questions!

[yak face]

It seems like youve got the general idea already. Most people paint anything that cant be easily accessed before assembly ,ie. Cockpits ,interiors , wheel wells . Then the main body can be painted after assembly has finished , finally adding any fragile bits that mught be knocked off during handling. As for primer , its a personal thing , i prefer to prime as much as i can as i find it helps the paint to stick better, some bits i will prime on the sprue , bigger bits like the main airframe i wait till its together before priming, and as you say its vital to scrape or sand any paint off of mating surfaces so the glue will work , cheers tony

[Guest]

This is something that gets asked a fair bit it is really down to personal choice. I tend to prime everything although where I prime depends on my mood. sometimes I prime on the sprue but other times I will stick a few bits together then prime and paint. It also depends on how easy the pieces will be to paint once stuck together. Externally for an aircraft I would say paint after assembly making sure you mask any areas that you don't want paint to get on. I am sure others will tell you there ways of doing things but as I already said it is really down to your own choice.

[tanktrack]

I find that i pre paint internal bits for obvious reasons and tend to paint after external builds as any excess glue and filling can be done pre painting.

[Guest]

As the guys above have said. Priming I pesonal but I always do. Having said that, I have been known to just paint tiny bits I forgot to put on afterwards, no one will know


As for painting, some paint the small bits on the sprue first. I rarely do this as they will inevitably want some clean up when you cut them off and then repaint them.


Anything like interior parts that can be seen once the model is built has to be painted first. For example, the inside of a cockpit. It would be difficult to paint them afterwards. A cockpit is usually assembled as much as can be for a single colour painting the things like seats and instrument dials painted prior to completing the cockpit as a sub assembly.


I would never paint the external parts prior to assembly for a couple of reasons. One, as mentioned above, you will probably need a bit of filling and sanding of the seams etc so you would end up painting it again. Two, the assembly stage requires a lot of handling and this could be detrimental to the painting you had done.


Main thing is to take your time, think it through and develop your own way of working. If it works for you then it's OK. This working method development is not something you will come up with as a concrete plan before you start, it is something that comes with time. You learn something from each kit, I still do, and you take that to the next one. That is all part of the fun of kit building. Enjoy

[Gern]

I figure I should paint them before removing them from the sprue, so I'd have to spray primer on the whole lot of pieces that are on that sheet. Would having primer on the rest of the pieces affect assembly in any way? I'd probably have to scratch it off of any surfaces requiring glue, right?

Most primers will stop your glues working so you do need to think about it but there's nothing to stop you masking off any pieces on the sprue that you don't want to prime. Don't use your expensive Tamiya tape for this though - any cheap pound shop tape will do. One quick way is to put the whole sprue inside a plastic bag, cut holes where you want to paint then just seal around the edges of the holes.


A couple of things I look at when deciding when to paint is how I am going to hold the piece (or sub-assembly) while painting it and where to put it while it dries. For tiny parts, sometimes the best way is to leave them on the sprue - this solves both problems. The other thing is where are the sprue attachment points. They will always need to be cleaned up so will the clean-up show on your paintwork? If so, take them off the sprue first.


For surfaces needing glue, if you can get to them, you can use the edge of a knife or a sanding stick to remove any primer. Be careful you don't remove any plastic though as you might create gaps which will need to be filled. If they're recessed or difficult to get to, use some very thin strips of tape to cover them.


Like Graham says, if you think it through you'll find a way of working which suits you and the kit you're working on. That may change on the next kit you build, but if you have a variety of methods you're happy with, just pick the one that seems best at the time.

[stona]

Good advice above.


I like to paint detail on the largest sub assembly possible, but what that will depend very much on the construction of the kit and will vary. I don't like to paint on the sprue for the reason given by Graham above, but I will paint small parts prior to assembly if I have to. I take them off the sprue (or casting block) and paint them individually, usually stuck to a cocktail stick with Blu-Tac. I've been doing precisely that with the little side consoles which will go into my current build's cockpit.


Cheers


Steve

[Guest]

Thanks, everyone! This is all great advice and you've pointed out some other "gotchas" that may not have crossed my mind until it was too late.


I just noticed that the spray paint I intend to use for the exterior is a "paint plus primer" instead of just a paint. (It's normal spray paint, not model-specific paint because I'm a cheap newbie). Does that mean I don't have to prime? This kit has a lot of fine little ridges and things and I don't want to lose the detail with an additional primer. Maybe I should get just regular spray paint and do a normal primer coat....

[Guest]

Thanks, everyone! This is all great advice and you've pointed out some other "gotchas" that may not have crossed my mind until it was too late.
I just noticed that the spray paint I intend to use for the exterior is a "paint plus primer" instead of just a paint. (It's normal spray paint, not model-specific paint because I'm a cheap newbie). Does that mean I don't have to prime? This kit has a lot of fine little ridges and things and I don't want to lose the detail with an additional primer. Maybe I should get just regular spray paint and do a normal primer coat....

Not sure what brand this is but am I right in thinking it is more a household paint rather than an automotive paint? If it is household then just go for it as it may be oil based rather than cellulose(lacquer) based. The reason I mention this is that an oil based will not harm the plastic but may take a while to dry.


Cellulose paints are what are often termed as 'hot' paints. This is because they can actually melt plastic. Now in paint terms that can mean that they actually micro etch into the surface of the plastic giving a good grip, if used correctly. Too much and it could do damage. A lot of automotive paints are now becoming more of an acrylic like structure and these are great to use. These include all the modelling based spray cans as well as the Halfords 'Plastic Primer' range, note Plastic not just Primer.


This does not mean if you use a cellulose paint you will see your model dissolve in front of you, there are many model related paints that are 'hot' paints and they are very good but need more care in their use more for health and safety than model related.


I got some primer in white to spray MDF radiator covers some years ago and, although they took ages to dry, I would have used them on a model.


Main thing to remember using spray cans is that you slowly build up the paint. This is often referred to as 'misting it on' as you do many very light coats rather than trying to get a full cover in one pass. Not only does misting it on produce a better finish, less likely to run, it also preserves surface detail and thin coats dry quicker than thick ones.


If you are unsure, get a four to six pint clean plastic milk bottle and practice your spraying on that first. Once you become confident in doing light misting coats, grab the model and go for it. I would also recomend this for beginners with an airbrush.

[Guest]

Wow, thanks! That is a ton of useful information. I appreciate you taking the time to teach me the ways of paint!


Yes, the paint I have is more of a household spray paint. It's Rustoleum 2X Ultracover Paint + Primer. I had used it on one of my biplanes, but I did run into some issues with it cracking once I applied the spray finish. So it may have been the paint at fault, the varnish (Krylon Crystal Clear Acrylic/Gloss), or the combination of both. I'm not sure.


I also have a plain old primer (Rustoleum 2X Ultracover Primer), which is also household paint. With one of my models, I used just primer because I liked the color, then just added details with a bottle of Testors and a brush. My other model I skipped the primer (I think?) and just used the paint+primer for the whole thing, adding details later with Testors. This is the one that cracked with the varnish coat.


Thanks for the warning about 'hot' paints. I will be sure to stay away from cellulose paints for now! And I think I'll use your method of testing with a plastic milk jug first as well. I am still rather heavy-handed with my paint application!

[Guest]

I hope it's okay that I double posted!


I do have another quick question. A lot of the interior parts are really really tiny and I am concerned about 1) taking them off the sprue to prime them and then losing them and 2) having the area be so small that it is hard to mask off the area I need to glue.


From what I have read, everyone highly recommends priming everything before painting. Would it be okay (or even better) to NOT prime these tiny interior pieces and just paint them? They aren't going to be seen very easily in a 1:72 C-47 and definitely not handled. Does priming really make a huge difference?


Just as a note, I WILL prime the exterior. I'm just not so sure about the interior right now.

[Gern]

If they're not going to be touched afterwards, I see no reason why they need to be primed. You will save yourself some time and trouble as you won't have any problems gluing the pieces.

[Guest]

Yeah, I don't imagine they'd be handled at all.


Thanks for the response! Knowing I don't have to prime take a load off my mind.

[Guest]

Main thing to remember using spray cans is that you slowly build up the paint. This is often referred to as 'misting it on' as you do many very light coats rather than trying to get a full cover in one pass. Not only does misting it on produce a better finish, less likely to run, it also preserves surface detail and thin coats dry quicker than thick ones.

I agree. But for a mirror finish as for cars, the last coat needs to be relatively thick, definitely wet, on the point of running (at least that's my experience with Tamiya Synthetic Lacquers, TS range.)

[Guest]

I agree. But for a mirror finish as for cars, the last coat needs to be relatively thick, definitely wet, on the point of running (at least that's my experience with Tamiya Synthetic Lacquers, TS range.)

I bow to your experience Steve, never worked with high gloss finishes, thanks for the advice