Moving to acrylics!

[zuludog]

As a returnee I have a large collection of enamel paints, but they are getting a bit old & crusty (not unlike their owner) and a couple of the colours have irreversibly dried up so I thought I'd replace them with acrylics

The only acrylic paints I have used so far have been the free Humbrol pots you get in Airfix kits, and I wasn't too impressed. However, i realise that there are better makes, and I'm ready to try again
Here's my plan -

My local model shop (well, it's about 30 mins bus ride away but I've made it to my free pass) is selling Tamiya acrylics at £1-45 so I'll get a few standard colours - black, white red etc

From the Scale Model Shop I'll try a few pots of different makes to see what they're like - a set of WW2 RAF by AK; plus individual colours from Mr Hobby and Vallejo

However, some of my enamels have hardly been used and are in good condition, so I'd like to use those as well. I understand that enamels and acrylics can be painted over each other as long as you let them harden?

Now some general questions about acrylic paint -

One of the things that put me off the Humbrol was that it dried very quickly, but I see you can get a retarder, and I've been watching videos on YouTube
Are they all interchangeable? ie can one make of retarder be used in the different makes of acrylic paint?
I see I see they mix up the paint & retarder on a palette; any reason why I couldn't simply add a few drops to a jar of paint and have a batch ready for use?

The manufacturers give dire warnings about only using their brand of thinners - any reason why I can't just use water?
I've also seen suggestions about thinning with windscreen washer fluid, de-icer, and isopropanol. I don't think I'd have the confidence to do that, at least not into the paint, though I might try it for cleaning the brushes

In fact any advice & comments would be appreciated

Some background info - I only paint by brush; WW2 RAF, USAAF, US Navy, & Luftwaffe. I no longer try to make the most absolutely best ever model, I just make them to a reasonable standard for my own satisfaction, so no fancy shading or weathering

[Dave Ward]

Zulu,
Tamiya aren't true water based acrylics - which is why you see isoprop & deicer used as thinners. The true water based acrylics ( Vallejo, AK, MiG etc ) can be thinned with tap water ( I use nothing else ). I've never tried my Vallejo retarder with any other make, but I don't see why it shouldn't work, branded thinners, the same thing.
Bear in mind acrylics are not as tough as enamels, they can easily scratch, and being thinner don't cover as well as enamels - several thin coats may be necessary.
I moved to exclusively acrylics about 5 years ago - when I started airbrushing. I live in a flat & spraying oil-based paints was not an option. It takes a bit of adapting your technique, but the ease of use, lack of smell etc etc is totally worth it.
Dave

[spanner570]

You'll get loads of different replies to your question, that's for sure.
My advise is keep it simple.
I just brush paint and use only Vallejo Model Air and Model Colour acrylics. Model Colour is thicker, so like Dave I simply thin it down with tap water. I know nothing about ratios, I just thin it until I get the coverage I want. I'm not bothered what others think about tap water, it works just fine for me. To each his own, mind..... :thumb2:

Use two or three thin coats of paint. The first coat will look bloody awful, stick with it and don't be tempted to thicken the paint.

Ron

[Guest]

As a returnee I have a large collection of enamel paints, but they are getting a bit old & crusty (not unlike their owner) and a couple of the colours have irreversibly dried up

Open a tin (one that hasn’t completely dried out yet, of course), clean the dried paint off the rim and the lid, and carefully close it again. If the lid fits well, enamels can pretty much be stored indefinitely. I have tins of Humbrol paints that are probably as old as I am (that is, from the mid-1970s — I bought them later, of course), and they’re still perfectly usable.

I understand that enamels and acrylics can be painted over each other as long as you let them harden?

Yep, no problems at all. Just don’t try to mix the two — if you have red enamel paint and yellow acrylic but need orange, don’t try to make it by mixing the two you have. Mixing enamels with enamels works fine, and acrylics with acrylics too, but trying to mix the two types isn’t going to go well.

One of the things that put me off the Humbrol was that it dried very quickly

All acrylics dry quickly, certainly compared to enamels, though some more so than others.

any reason why I couldn't simply add a few drops to a jar of paint and have a batch ready for use?

I’ve never used a retarder, but I do know that if you store thinned acrylic paint (mixed ready for airbrushing) it tends to go off within a few weeks. Could be much the same thing happens if you add retarder instead of thinner.

The manufacturers give dire warnings about only using their brand of thinners - any reason why I can't just use water?

None at all. They tell you to use their thinners because that’s what they sell. Just try something else and see if it works — water will be almost guaranteed to, alcohols might or might not, depending on the paint; in all cases you’ll learn something from the experiment. For example, I tried thinning Vallejo Model Color with isopropanol (windscreen wiper fluid) to spray it, and just couldn’t get it to work, so I learned the lesson that I shouldn’t do that again

I've also seen suggestions about thinning with windscreen washer fluid, de-icer, and isopropanol. I don't think I'd have the confidence to do that, at least not into the paint, though I might try it for cleaning the brushes

You have nothing to lose but a few drops of paint: take some paint on your brush, put it onto a palette (the lid of a jam jar, a glazed kitchen tile, whatever) and try mixing in a few drops of the thinner you intend to use. You’ll quickly see whether it works or not.

Tamiya aren't true water based acrylics - which is why you see isoprop & deicer used as thinners. The true water based acrylics ( Vallejo, AK, MiG etc ) can be thinned with tap water ( I use nothing else ).

Tamiya and Gunze-Sangyo paints can also be thinned perfectly well with tap water.

[Peter Gillson]

Hi

Here is how I made a staywet pallet for acrylic paints which you may find usefull. Being airtight it is very effective at stopping the paint drying out.

Peter

[Steven000]

Lots of great replies I think,
I also changed to acrylics because of the smell and my old dried out stock of enamels.

I like to thin my Vallejo paint with their 'Vallejo airbrush thinner' for airbrush work, this product has the same sticky-glue-stuff in it as the Vallejo paint has, which makes the thin airbrush coat stick better to the surface.

For hand painting and cleaning I use water.

Cheers
Steven

[zuludog]

Thanks for all your advice. here are some replies and my progress so far -

I've bought a few jars of Tamiya acrylics. The man in the shop suggested I also got some Tamiya thinners. Oh well, it's not that expensive, so I got some anyway. There's only one way to find out if it's better than water.

I can see the sense of staying with one brand and getting used to it, but at first I wanted to try a few different ones and find out for myself what they were like.
So I placed an order with SMS for a couple or so jars each of AK, Meng, Mr Hobby, and Vallejo; plus retarder

Since I placed the order I remembered Boyes; this is a chain of department stores in the north of England. They have a modelling department and last time I was in one I think I saw some Vallejo paint. I'll visit my local store in a day or two and see what they have

I'd never heard of a wet palette till now, but it seems straightforwards enough; I've also watched a couple of videos
I already have a couple of plastic containers courtesy of Sainsbury's delicatessen counter, and I've just bought some baking parchment

I wonder....... perhaps a wet palette + retarder + a bit of thinning might improve the Humbrol acrylics that I already have

I've had a trigger spray bottle of windscreen de-icer for ages, but recent mild winters mean I've hardly used it; might come in handy

I have a couple of small sheets of glass that I already use as palettes; and my local Range store has dimpled palettes cheaply enough

I think that'll do for the moment. All I've got to do now is make something!

[Guest]

hello I use reaper paints acrylics just love them.I also use water to thin them but I use distilled water as the tap water I have has minerals in it and sometimes it does weird things to the paint.makes it lay down weird.
RICK