Catastrophic paint failure...answers on a post card please

[David Lovell]

Working on the zil when I noticed the paint coming away ,it can only be breaking away from the primer ,now I've never had this happen before, the only diffrent thing I've done on this build is use mr surfacer 1500 and mr self leveling thinner, I've only gone back to using kleer on the last couple of builds usually I put filters and washes straight over flat paint ,yes I will admit my weathering technique is very aggressive and uses lots of low odour white spirit but I've never suffered this before. Personally I think the primer is to smooth nothing for the paint to key to ,the paints used were mig ammo thinned with the self leveling thinner ,if you can thin tamiya acrylic mr color aqueous with it why not mig ammo went through the airbrush with zero problems. So bit of a bummer perhaps I'll go back to my faithful old rattle can primer. Can anyone recommend a acrylic gloss varnish perhaps the way to go .

Stay safe all Dave.

[Lee Drennen]

Dave. I’ve only seen this when the primer was not cured enough. I’m a old rattle can Hairy brush guy myself can’t help you on the airbrush part.

[Dave Ward]

David,
the only things I can think of are surace grease before priming, and not sufficient time for the primer to really dry. As a gloss acrylic varnish, I use Xtracrylix, neat for brush use & slightly diluted for airbrush
Dave

[Mr Bowcat]

I've never had an issue with Mr S 1500, it's very tough when cured. As others have said, either contaminants under the primer or not fully cured. I normally leave it a full 24 hours.

[Guest]

It's not something I've come across either Dave. I've certainly never had an issue with paint delaminating from Mr Surfacer, whether it be their own lacquers, or vallejo or ak3 acrylics.

My first thought would be that maybe the paint & thinner aren't compatible, and it's broken down too much to cure properly, leaving it with no strength / shear resistance. That's only a guess though, since I've never used that combination.

I'm pretty certain Tamiya & Mr hobby are alcohol based, as is MLT, which is why they work well together.

[KarlW]

If you didn't tell us that was unintentional I would of thought that was just weathering.......

[adt70hk]

Hi

If you didn't tell us that was unintentional I would of thought that was just weathering.......

Hi David

I'm sorry but I can't help with your question as I've never used those paints and primers before but Karl actually makes a very good point.

I realise that it hasn't worked as you would have wished but I had to look several times before I realised that the paint flaking wasn't weathering/damage as Karl has said.

In all seriousness I generally think that it actually adds to the finish.

ATB

Andrew

[David Lovell]

Thanks guys as usual help is there for thoes that need it (as they say at hogwarts) as Andy says perhaps AK and mr leveling thinner aren't compatible, I might try to make it less obvious if not just pretend it was intentional, just bit of a gutter was enjoying this one. Dave

[David Lovell]

Same is happening with the cab section as Andy (paint guy)says perhaps its broken down the paint to much ,there is no problem with the primer thats stuck to the kit like the perverbial next time out I'll go back to mr aqueous thinner like I've done before with no repercussions, just as one starts to enjoy the hobby again it comes unstuck a small setback I know but does make me wonder if its worth it.

[Guest]

I would have guessed that the primer is not cured David. Then the primer slovents/binders not cured permeate the paint film & stop the paint curing.

Acrylic gloss. Best I have found thin dries quickly very for giving if applied a little thick in places does not curtain

Alcad 11 Lacquer Aqua Gloss Clear. Used it on Tamiya XF & X plus all Vellejo. Not one mishap in 3 years.

The more coats the higher the gloss. Recoat approx 60 mins.

Laurie

[David Lovell]

I would have guessed that the primer is not cured David. Then the primer slovents/binders not cured permeate the paint film & stop the paint curing.

Acrylic gloss. Best I have found thin dries quickly very for giving if applied a little thick in places does not curtain

Alcad 11 Lacquer Aqua Gloss Clear. Used it on Tamiya XF & X plus all Vellejo. Not one mishap in 3 years.

The more coats the higher the gloss. Recoat approx 60 mins.

Laurie

Thanks Laurie I'm sure the primer was left for at least a couple of days ,surely I'd have thought if it hadn't cured it would have separated from the plastic itself, as I said only used two diffrent products so will start to reverse engineer on next build starting with the thinners ,once again many thanks for your input. Dave

[colin m]

I'm another one for the weathering angle. Just spray over it very lightly, and see if it looks like some damage, as in scale damage.

[Guest]

Thanks Laurie I'm sure the primer was left for at least a couple of days ,surely I'd have thought if it hadn't cured it would have separated from the plastic itself, as I said only used two diffrent products so will start to reverse engineer on next build starting with the thinners ,once again many thanks for your input. Dave

I use Stynnylerez primer David. For me it is a good primer. Noticed that, as a lot of primers that the surface is very smooth & slightly off matt. Difficult to explain.

To over come that I always wet & dry (with water) the surface of the primer to give a slight edge for holding. I use a 1500 or better still a well used 1200 gauge wet & dry paper.

The only other thought. Before moving into a flat I used the garage to model & spray paint. I did have some failures. I put this down to temperature control banging the heater on while in the garage then switching off. Not helpful as the heated air picks up moisture which can then as it cools down & reaches dew point sheds the moisture on cold sufaces.

Also, using Tamiya XF, mist coat then after 15 mins or so give it a good coat.

One thing for certain when things go wrong after all the trouble taken it is frustration in the extreme.

Laurie

[JR]

David at first I'd thought it was chipping! Can only think that Dave has it right, surface grease. I've had that happen and used it to my advantage with weathering. Glad to know I'm not alone with having this happen.

[mrtintheweb]

Maybe the paint comes with built-in weathering? lol