Vallejo Model Air and dry tip - this might help......

[Tim Marlow]

The paint should look wet when it hits the surface Bob. If it doesn’t then you’ll risk a dusty or orange peeled finish.

[AlanG]

Might have to give that Vallejo Flow Improver a go Laurie. I have a couple of projects coming up that involve a lot of mottling.

[Guest]

Thanks Tim, MRP is pre thinned so will have to experiment with adding self levelling to get to the right amount, i do tend to spray not to close, so i think thats a big part of my issues

Sorry to butt in Bob, but I'd agree. I find the solvents in MRP flash (evaporate) really quickly, so the paint could well be drying before it hits the surface. A little levelling thinner might help, but go steady as they are already very thin. Start with a drop or two in your cup.

Personally I go in pretty close instead (if the needle hits the model, back off a bit :tongue-out2: ) and use really low pressure (down to single figures if you believe the gauge), and remember it is an airBRUSH. For so long I treated mine like a mini spray gun, but once I got my head around using it like a brush a lot of things clicked into place and I'm now much happier with the results I get.

[BattleshipBob]

Sorry to butt in Bob, but I'd agree. I find the solvents in MRP flash (evaporate) really quickly, so the paint could well be drying before it hits the surface. A little levelling thinner might help, but go steady as they are already very thin. Start with a drop or two in your cup.

Personally I go in pretty close instead (if the needle hits the model, back off a bit :tongue-out2: ) and use really low pressure (down to single figures if you believe the gauge), and remember it is an airBRUSH. For so long I treated mine like a mini spray gun, but once I got my head around using it like a brush a lot of things clicked into place and I'm now much happier with the results I get.

Excellent, many thanks

When i first used MRP i thinned it :upside: my god it ran in and straight out of the brush no need to press the trigger lol

[adt70hk]

All good info Andrew. Glad it works for you! Out of interest, how fluid is this stuff? I have two, but neither really does what I want. Vallejo drying retarder is like treacle and turns VJ model colour into something more akin to heavy body acrylics. Windsor and Newton drying retarder is designed for heavy body acrylics and give the same issues. A retarder that is closer to water in consistency would be a nice addition to the armoury.

Not sure this is flow aid though, I think it slows down paint drying rather than increasing fluidity. That is how it reduces tip drying, the paint stays fluid longer so can more easily get blown off the tip by the airstream.
Flow aid is more like dish soap/washing up liquid and works by reducing surface tension in the water. it will stop paint beading up and will enable it to “wet” the surface more easily. Vallejo “Matt medium” is a flow aid and matting medium so may work well in conjunction with your drying extender......

Hi Tim

Sorry saw your response and forgot to reply.....:disappointed2:

The retarder definitely leans a long way to the watery side - around the same as Vallejo's thinner or flow aid.

As I think explained it seems to leave the mixture more 'fluid' than the equivalent amount of thinner or flow aid but not appearing thin/transparent - but that may be my eyes deceiving me. Hope that makes sense.

As for not being flow aid - agree it's not. I'd been adding flow aid in a similar ratio but this seems to work better.

HTH

Andrew

[David Lovell]

As you all know a long time ago I re homed anything Vallejo in the best place for it , stop and think Vallejo is a massive brand they must be world leaders within the hobby surely it can't be that bad that you need a degree in chemistry to use the stuff(in my case at the age of fourteen school asked mum if she wouldn't mind not sending me back after the summer holidays) perhaps my education short fall was the reason I couldn't use them , humor aside chaps surely ninety nine percent of Vallejo users must have problem free usage else the company would have disappeared up their own ages ago. Why carry on with something that obviously doesn't work for you or your methods l can think of two brands of paint that come in acrylic and lacquer that are far superior to Vallejo that are problem free and easy to use or is it because they come in the dead easy to mix jars ,you don't need paint shakers or ball-bearings like you do with the nice little dropper bottles. Sorry chaps you have a great and peaceful experience building your model only to become hateful and stressed at the next stage knowing that the products you use are going to seriously taint your whole experience. Dave

[Tim Marlow]

Hi Dave. The reason they haven’t disappeared is easy. Vallejo are unsurpassed in brush painting. They are absolutely reliable and have probably the biggest range out there. They mix and glaze superbly and are useable for every technique there is. They are not good through an airbrush though, in my experience, so despite having over a hundred different VJ paints, I use Tamiya and Mr colour for that! There is no “one paint to rule them all” it’s horses for courses.....besides, trying out lots of different things to get the effects you want is one of the fun bits in modelling isn’t it?

[Guest]

Agree with Tim. Horses for courses. Vallejo is great for certain things. Hand painting. Also for effects at low pressure plus not as wanted wipe it off immedaitly especially if it is over Tamiya you will not budge the Tamiya.

Tamiya is great for the others. But Mr Tamiya more colours please

Laurie

PS Help lost spelling thing & mine is not good

[David Lovell]

Hi Dave. The reason they haven’t disappeared is easy. Vallejo are unsurpassed in brush painting. They are absolutely reliable and have probably the biggest range out there. They mix and glaze superbly and are useable for every technique there is. They are not good through an airbrush though, in my experience, so despite having over a hundred different VJ paints, I use Tamiya and Mr colour for that! There is no “one paint to rule them all” it’s horses for courses.....besides, trying out lots of different things to get the effects you want is one of the fun bits in modelling isn’t it?

As I said Tim there a massive brand and surely 99% of users don't have problems , its just the model air users continue to be frustrated by the splatter and tip drying problem ,as I said when you've chilled out with the build why continue to spoil the fun with something that isn't working for you . I'm all for trying different thing for diffrent effects ive no problem with that , its their frustration at not being able to enjoy using there airbrush time ,I love using mine its one of the fun bits in modeling isn't it ? It would be nice if some of the guys on here who spray it with no problems stood up and pointed them in the right direction. Dave.
Thanks Tim for making this a healthy discussion if some of the lads can surmount their problems then job done.

[Guest]

Actually I stopped Vallejo (airbrushing) & went to Tamiya as I was frustrated with the stuff peeling in strips when removing masking.

Shame as once they produced the Flow Improver no problem airbrushing.

[adt70hk]

As I said Tim there a massive brand and surely 99% of users don't have problems , its just the model air users continue to be frustrated by the splatter and tip drying problem ,as I said when you've chilled out with the build why continue to spoil the fun with something that isn't working for you . I'm all for trying different thing for diffrent effects ive no problem with that , its their frustration at not being able to enjoy using there airbrush time ,I love using mine its one of the fun bits in modeling isn't it ? It would be nice if some of the guys on here who spray it with no problems stood up and pointed them in the right direction. Dave.
Thanks Tim for making this a healthy discussion if some of the lads can surmount their problems then job done.

Agree with Tim. Horses for courses. Vallejo is great for certain things. Hand painting. Also for effects at low pressure plus not as wanted wipe it off immedaitly especially if it is over Tamiya you will not budge the Tamiya.

Tamiya is great for the others. But Mr Tamiya more colours please

Laurie

PS Help lost spelling thing & mine is not good

Hi Dave. The reason they haven’t disappeared is easy. Vallejo are unsurpassed in brush painting. They are absolutely reliable and have probably the biggest range out there. They mix and glaze superbly and are useable for every technique there is. They are not good through an airbrush though, in my experience, so despite having over a hundred different VJ paints, I use Tamiya and Mr colour for that! There is no “one paint to rule them all” it’s horses for courses.....besides, trying out lots of different things to get the effects you want is one of the fun bits in modelling isn’t it?

Gentleman

Thanks for always as your thoughts, most enlightening.

I've just realised I didn't fully explain myself in the intro - in short I'd asked Comrade Race how he was getting on following his move to AK 3rd Gen acrylics - which I hear very good things about and the discussion moved onto this medium.

For both of us lacquer based paints are off the table due to the smell - I model in my kitchen. When I first got an AB circa 4 years ago, Vallejo generally seemed to have the best reputation of the water based acrylics and so I am where I am. I don't have the cash to make a wholesale change and so figured if there were any people in the same situation as me, this might be a cheap way to make life a bit easier.


Tim - I'm off work today and managed to have a quick AB session :smiling:. The extender medium is similar to Vallejo's flow aid in consistency and so is thicker than their thinner. I was using my 0.2mm AB, rather than the larger one general purpose one and again it worked really well at the ratio I stated earlier - no dry tip.


All the best

Andrew

[Del640]

I like Vallejo air, it's all I use, I am quite confident with it as well, but everyone's different!

[Guest]

I like Vallejo air, it's all I use, I am quite confident with it as well, but everyone's different!

I have to say, I tried every trick in the book to get it to spray out of my H&S Infinity, and it just wouldn't play ball. I even stopped up until the stroke of midnight once to see if that helped, but still no joy.

However, after getting a new blow pipe (Gunze / Mr Hobby PS-275), I threw it in straight from the bottle and it just worked :surprised:

I always believed it was something I was doing wrong, but a change of tool and it was like night & day! A touch more tip dry than the AK acrylics I swapped to, but that's inevitable with most paints and a very easy fix.

[adt70hk]

I have to say, I tried every trick in the book to get it to spray out of my H&S Infinity, and it just wouldn't play ball. I even stopped up until the stroke of midnight once to see if that helped, but still no joy.

However, after getting a new blow pipe (Gunze / Mr Hobby PS-275), I threw it in straight from the bottle and it just worked :surprised:

I always believed it was something I was doing wrong, but a change of tool and it was like night & day! A touch more tip dry than the AK acrylics I swapped to, but that's inevitable with most paints and a very easy fix.

That's odd Andy. I've tried it from five different ABs, two of which were cheap Chinese jobs and it's never been that bad.

How are you finding the pistol grip to be use. Never tried one did it take much getting used to? I know you use bigger versions at work.

ATB.

Andrew

[Guest]

That's odd Andy. I've tried it from five different ABs, two of which were cheap Chinese jobs and it's never been that bad.

Similar for me. The freebies that came with my first compressor sprayed it ok, as did my Bartsharp 116B

How are you finding the pistol grip to be use. Never tried one did it take much getting used to? I know you use bigger versions at work.

Ideal for me, much more natural and comfortable than a conventional one. Plus I can use my regular (middle) trigger finger, with my index pointing where I'm aiming.