Comments on weathering please

[Guest]

Here are three pics of my 1/48 Spit. MkI which I have just weathered using Flory Weathering Wash Dark Dirt and Brown, the next step being to add matt varnish. This is my first attempt at weathering. Yet to come is the final flat varnish coat.

Is the weathering too much or too little?

Does it look right? If not, why not?

Could I please have critical comments

Some of the panel lines were moulded very shallow, and some of the rest of the lines probably filled with the previous colour, then two gloss coats of varnish, leaving little room for dirt.

The underside colour coat being very light, any weathering on the original is bound to be more noticeable than on darker camo. The wheel wells are fairly mucky. I imagine the Spit. taking off repeatedly on wet and rather soggy grass with bare patches of earth.

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[Centurion3RTR]

I know I don't build 'things with wings' but to me Steve sir, she looks fine. With a little aluminium on the wing root where the pilot has been she'll look great.

Have fun, John

[Ian M]

Well Steve, My humble opinion is this:

You have it pretty much in the bag. RAF had a general order that said that their aircraft had to be kept clean. Dirt = weight and Drag. Two things you do not want on an aircraft.

It could well be that directly after landing from a sortie, they could of had a good deal of oil and soot on them but that would of been removed as well as it could have been as soon as practical. If it was just down for fuel and ammo, the canopy would have been cleaned, and maybe the worst of any oil wiped away. First when the "battle" was over they would get a good clean.

A bit of grime in panel joins, behind the coolers and filters would be about it. Machine gun blowback would also stain as would the exhaust . (For which I would suggest a very dark brown or grey, Black just looks to err black :-)

You have got it pretty much right.

If you are after a well used look, some chipping and wear on the paint, either down to the primer or even down to the bare metal is the best way to go. Mud and muck is for tanks and trucks.

Ian M

[Dave W]

I see you've built it as a pre war 19 squadron mark 1.Being pre war it would have been kept fairly clean.So I also think you have got it about right.

[rickoshea52]

Great effects Steve. I can't speak with any authority about aircraft maintenance during the BoB but from my experience with modern aircraft they get grimy in a short space of time but usually in specific areas depending on the role, type of aircraft and environment.

RAF Puma's get very dirty underneath from landing on rough landing sites etc, likewise for Sea Kings. Exhausts and vents are classic grime magnets. On Nimrod's the underside of the wings get dirty with streaking similar to your effect here.

Looking at the underside of your Spitfire I'd say it is realistic with the streaking from the gun ports and trailing edges. I recall a film clip of a flight of Spitfires peeling off to dive at some dirty bosch below and you can see streaking like the effect you have created.

Although Ian M suggested that mud is for tanks and trucks there is scope to bring a little bit of mud into your weathering here. These kites would be operating from grass runways often so although mud wouldn't be caked on there would be some in the tyre side walls - our Sea Kings and Pumas would often come back with lumps of soil, sand and the occasional cow turd stuck to the landing gear!

The trick with weathering for me is to do your research, study photo's and keep it subtle and a little at a time.

I think you're well on track with this modelling effect. It's not everyone's cup of tea and your idea of a dog's breakfast could be someone else's work of art - to me, yours is pretty damn good.

[mossiepilot]

My opinion for weathering is "Less is best", at least for European theater fighters anyway. The ground crews were very protective and proud of their aircraft, the aircraft was theirs, the pilot just flew it!. There are stories of ground crew telling off pilots for bringing their aircraft back with bullet holes in them!!!.

From what you have posted I think you've got it right, not too much muck.

Tony.

[Guest]

Hi Steve,

I've used Flory models weathering on my 2 builds and would say that you will be surprised when applying the top coat just how much the panel lines darken and show through. If your finding the panel lines are not holding the weathering dirt then a technique I've found that works is once the wash is applied and dry, take an ear bud andvery lightly moisten it and then work across the panel line at 90 degrees to remove the excess weather.

Atb, Colin.

[Guest]

Thanks folks. That is very helpful, and encouraging. I have reduced the weathering of some of the panel lines, and toned down the mud in the wheelspace. I have added some exhaust stains, and will do chipping with a silver pencil.

[Dave W]

As you've done it as a pre war machine I wouldn't go mad with the chipping.no.19 were the first squadron to get the spitfire .So they would have been the pride of the RAF.So they would have been imaculate pre war.

[Guest]

OK. But just a very little chipping to see how it turns out.

[Guest]

Steve looked at this a few times befire making any comment.

Firstly I have only weathered one plane out of the 10 or so that I have ever produced. That is except for one minor investment into a 1/72.

Weathering is very much I think, from looking at the models produced here over the 3 years, very much a matter of I like you do not. So it is for the model maker to decide what they like or dislike.

So what I have to say is from my perspective & not criticism. First the Flory stuff when producing the Sworfish drove me mad. Think probably as it was water based it slid every where I did not want it & vice versa I am sure all down to my competence. Going to try on the Lysander, now getting towards finality, Valljo washes as they seem kinder to my style of working.

With the Flory I only put one coat of vanish on (Vallejo of course) & mine was not as shiny as yours seems to show in the pictures. I would think that as you state you had filled up some of the panel lines then perhaps there was to much varnish on the model. This has lost you some of the weathering on the panel lines. I like to see the panel lines full. Not sure where it is but Vaughan's latest model has the finish that I crave for on my future weathering. But that is me & may not be your ambition.

Think that if I had been putting on the weathering I would have removed a lot more of the black where it looks very heavy. I would also tried to accentuate the minor panel lines & as said before make sure the whole panel line is filled. Just found it http://www.scale-models.co.uk/aircraft-pictures/19327-finished-hasegawa-1-32-fw190-a8.html. That is just right for me.

Hope you do not mind all the above. I have found my first weathering attempt difficult & any help I find most useful. Also found that I had to work hard at it. I imagined just slapping it on but it is I found an art to be mastered.

Laurie

[Guest]

For exhaust stack staining I experimented with brush and gouache but it didn't look good, rather contrived. I thought airbrushing would give a more uniform and sputtery effect with featherd edges. I tried Flory Dark Dirt, 5 PSI, 0.4 mm needle, and the trigger pullback restricted to very little, on to a channel of White Tack (see first photo) and that worked well. However, using my AB (direct on the model) with Flory Dark Dirt and the same AB settings, I got what I think is a reasonable result for that and the cannon streaks (second photo).

They refused to load, so here they are agin:

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From what DaveW said, my story is that this machine has just returned from two sorties in a row, the grass airfield being soggy from overnight rain, and the ground crew are lining up eager to polish it!

This stuff is good fun!

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[Guest]

Steve I used a large brush & sloshed it on, Flory that is, waited until it was near dy & then with a dampened, slightly, tissue went about wiping away that which I did not want. Then where Flory had not made a good job I did it again. Got very despondent during this process, probaly impatience, but after putting on the matt varnish I was relatively pleased.

Laurie

[Guest]

Laurie: Your post "Steve looked at this a few times befire making any comment......



I agree with what you say about the gloss varnish coats filling thepanel lines due to overly thick spraying. That was because I had had lots of trouble getting gloss varnish to be glossy (on my Spit., for before decalling, and after to seal the decals). In future I will try to get a reasonable gloss with a thinner cot (although I remember noticing that the model as moulded (Airfix A05115A) had rather shallow panel lines. I could have re-scribed them. Yes, Vaughn's fw190-a8 is very good.

As you say, weathering is what people want. As my very recent post said, I have concocted an operational scenario to justify the level of dirt. BTW, three panel lines have a strip decal on them and are therefore very prominent. I have no idea what they are for.

I was surprised to find that the Flory Dark Dirt did not gather up on the glossy coat into lots of blobs too much, even without a tiny spec of washing-up liquid as Flory mentions. Wiping with a slightly damp cloth as he advises evened thing out in my case.

You say: "I imagined just slapping it on but it is I found an art to be mastered." Not 'arf!

Thanks very much for the comments. Much appreciated. I have learned a lot, ready for next time.

[Guest]

Steve I learnt form another Steve here about the best panel scriber I have come across. Have 3 others all of a not so good.

It is the Bare Metal Panel Scriber. Made in Canada. Introduction To Using Bare-Metal Foil - Bare-Metal Foil Co.

All othere scribers I have used, 3, make a groove but the displaced groove plastic has to go some where & forms a mound each side of the groove.

The bare Metal type actually cuts out the plastic in a ribbon & makes a much better job. Also easier to manipulate as the end is sharp & there is little pushing or pulling. I use Dymo tape or plastic car lining tape as a guide. Found the Dymo is better. If the panel lines are shallow this one will carefully make them deeper. It is excellent for replacing panel lines lost in sanding at the seams.

By the way I use Vallejo Varnish & that is very thin & does not affect the panel lines very much.

Laurie